MBA Job Placement Rates Trending Higher

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November 10, 2010
MBA Express

NEWS  THIS WEEK'S TOP STORY FINDING A JOB MBA Job Placement Rates Trending Higher MBA talent is once again in demand, with placement rates bouncing back from recession lows. But salaries are flat, and signing bonuses are scarce   MORE TOP STORIES IDEAS & INNOVATION Part-Time MBAs: Greater Expectations UT-Dallas' Monica Powell explains why today's part-time MBA students want more from their degrees—and the career-management office—and what this means for academic programs MBA JOURNAL: SUMMER INTERNSHIP A Beautiful Internship "From beginning to end, I'm thankful for my internship. It confirmed that beauty is my true calling" LIVE CHAT Chat Transcript: IE Business School MBA Admissions IE Business School's Lisa Bevill fields questions about applications, internships, and moving to Madrid GMAC Unveils Sample Questions For New GMAT Anybody who will be taking the GMAT in the near future might want to sit up and pay attention to this. Business School, Explained Stanford GSB MBA Admissions Director Derrick Bolton explains what an MBA applicant can do to stand out to admissions officers  B-SCHOOL FORUMS Visit BW Online's interactive forums for wide-ranging discussions about management education. Search through over 1,359,000 posts for topics that interest you. Join in today! Here are a few samples of recent messages: Getting into B-School — Booth PT Program From: kaBOOM To: All I was wondering if anyone knows if there is much of a difference between recruiting from the Booth part-time program vs. the full-time program. If I don't get into the full-time program, I was thinking of applying for the part-time, but I'm wondering if maybe it would be better recruiting-wise if I were to be in a full-time program at a lower ranked school instead of the PT program at Booth. Anyone in the Booth PT program or know anything about this? Thank you. From: xiao To: kaBOOM It depends on what you want to do. If you do not want to switch career completely, PT at Booth would be great. What differentiates the PT from FT is lack of internship. That is the biggest difference. Obviously lack of time for networking and experience are two other differences as well. But PT would be way cheaper in terms of debt. But yeah, overall it depends on your risk profile and goals. From: Entropy To: kaBOOM I would not recommend part-time unless you're happy at your current firm, have no desire to switch into a different field, and your firm is paying for at least a part of the tuition. Otherwise, it would be a huge waste of your time and resources to go, even though booth is an awesome school, and the pt campus is sweet. Booth pt students do have access to full-time job recruiting, but you will lose out to full-time students almost everytime, especially if you're in finance. Also, the FT students do look down on the PT students and absolutely hate it when the latter show up at recruiting events. From: kaBOOM To: Entropy Okay, this is interesting stuff. I saw on the website that recruiting events would be open to part-timers, but had no idea about the reaction to this of the full-timers. That's kinda sad because I say if a firm happens to want a certain part-time individual then maybe that full-timer who lost out should realize that he is not the best candidate, suck it up, and move on. Thank you for your insight. From: Entropy To: kaBOOM Yes, the recruiting events are open to PT students. But I know for a fact that most full-time people look down on PT folks as those who got into booth through the backdoor. I don't know what field you want to go into, but for finance jobs like sales& trading, hedge funds, investment management, PT people have no shot when competing with full-timers. For consulting and general management jobs, i think part-timers would have a better shot. From: JinShil2 To: Entropy I agree with most of the sentiments in this post EXCEPT the notion that PT have NO chance of landing choice finance jobs as a Booth PT. To be sure, since Booth PT are excluded from internship recruiting, switching to a finance career through PT is more difficult but it can be done. Namely, I know of Booth PT who have networked their way into getting a finance internship with likes of GS. They had to, of course, quit their full time jobs and they could only get internship after their 1.5-2 years of school (firms are not interested in giving internships to people who are 2-3 years removed from graduation). Yes, FT Boothies don't care for the PT students showing up at recruiting events and PT get a different colored badges so the recruiters know the difference. Plus, FT and PT tends to have different events such as separate Halloween parties. They rarely mingle socially especially because their main buildings are far apart. This does not mean there is an active animosity between FT and PT (except maybe during recruiting events), but they don't necessarily see each other as absolute peers. Getting into B-School — Spotty Work Exp From: MoonMoon To: All Hi All, Asian/ Female/28 I am planning to apply for Class of 2012 Business Schools Like Insead,LBS, Stern, Columbia. I am very worried about my work experience. I do not have an year long experience on my resuem till date. I have a 10 month work exp at Deloitte's HR consulting (March 2008 - jan 2009) and then I started a not for profit org (Jan 2009 - March 2010) Since march I have been working as an independent compensation consultant. I am taking my GMAT and hoping to score 700. Can some one please advise how do I enhance my work profile and also do I have a shot at these schools From: BosMBAasap To: MoonMoon You're going to need a story that connects all of these work experiences together and to your long term goal. Moreover you will need to show advancement and leadership experiences. From: MoonMoon To: BosMBAasap Thanks so much for the reply. But Do you think I have a shot at INsead, Stern, Columbia, Duke, Berkley And also for leadership I have started a chapter of a non profit in 2009 .. Any ideas if i should do anything else to enhance my profile. Also I am thinking of applying for 2012 Class . Any ideas on that .. Thanks so mcuh for your help From: BosMBAasap To: MoonMoon I don't think you are excluded from any of those schools but it's hard to say without knowing more about your profile, etc.. Basically, the best anyone can hope to be is "competitive" that is within the admissions criteria for a given school. After that, it's all about luck. Getting into B-School — Oddball Applications From: anak84 To: All I wonder if anyone has any light to shed on my situation. I graduated with a 3.9 from UPenn ten years ago with a major in Psychology/English/Biochemistry. I worked as an actor after graduating and did off broadway before moving to Los angeles to go to USC film school. I put together a production company and produced as well as directed several films. And now I feel that before I get too old I would like to get an MBA or an Executive MBA. My concern is that I haven't worked in business or studied business formally. I self taught myself everything to create and finance my company as well as distribute and market my product. But as for formal business education, my thesis was about economic psychology and decision making/risk analysis and I had a few statistic courses but i imagine that most applicants are engineers or business students who come from 3-5 years at Goldman Sachs. Will my past hurt me? I am only targeting upper tier schools (top 20) in metropolitan cities (Tuck being the only exception). If I was 22 I may not be so rigid but it's just not worth it for me to spend 2 years and get an MBA from "Generic St. U" So though I'm sure I could get into some business school is there a chance that I can get into Wharton or Tuck and if not then maybe a Hass or even Anderson, McCombs, or Marshall? Also, when I spoke with Wharton and told them my background they pushed their San Francisco executive MBA. I feel like if I apply to a Wharton executive MBA program I'll be laughed at ...loudly. Aren't executive MBA programs more difficult to get into than full times programs? Not to sound arrogant but I'm not worried about the other components of my application. I have nearly As in any course I've ever taken and usually get close to perfect scores on standardized tests. The math on the GMAT is easy for me as well and I've always been a skillful writer. Again I'm not stroking myself I'm just reasserting that I fear I still may get knocked due to my odd past and presumed lack of experience in a corporate setting. Thanks for reading this. From: numbersky To: anak84 Why don't you apply to all the top schools a 25 year old with your record and likely GMAT would apply to. At worst HBS might turn you down. Don't bother with Wharton SF unless you really don't want to go full time. From: BosMBAasap To: anak84 What do you want to do with you MBA? That is something noticeably lacking from your post. If you lack a clear plan that seems realistic, you may have less of a chance. Still, don't feel constrained to Exec MBA's, there are plenty of people in their early 30's in full time MBA programs. Also, your distinct past will be an asset, moreover film entertainment is an industry that some MBA's are very interested in but notoriously struggle to break into. Your background could be seen as an asset to your classmates. However, to round things out, you may want to ensure that you have A's in quant courses (upper level math, stats, etc.) among your other A's to demonstrate you have that capacity. Not necessarily required but will no doubt strengthen your candidacy. From: anak84 To: BosMBAasap Thanks for the replies. ACtually my method of madness is very structured I just didn't want to belabor the post with more details. I want to form a production studio forging the advent of the changing media world with new innovations in media presentation and distribution as well as marketing. You don't need an MBA but in my experience the one's who go into such ventures without proper business education or backing flounder. I eat flounder I don't wish to do it also. I don't have any upper level quant courses except Physics II for engineers which I earned an A in. I had to get special permission to take it since I didn't have any background in physics or high level math and neve took Physics ins high school. I got an A in it only because I can memorize anything in seconds and am a very good problem solver so I can apply equations to a circumstance and solve. I don't know jack about physics or quantam theory aside from what Scott Bakula taught me. So even if I go back and take some courses I would have to take entry level courses since I can't just bust into differential equations and linear algebra classes or higher level actuarial classes. I may take a stats course this winter semester and apply early to B-School next year but in such case it'd be a long term plan and I don't want to put aside a year of my life, take extra courses and have it all be for nought. Some business schools like Haas told me that my GMAT will reflect my skills to them while Wharton noted that they would like to see some quant courses and I should go take them and Tuck just didnt' care and seemed exceptionally liberal minded. And Columbia hung up on me though I think it was due to a bad connection not a display of negligence. From: Jock4Mba To: anak84 Thanks for sharing your fascinating story with us. I empathise with you that as a non traditional applicant, the path looks challenging. With traditional consultant/banker/engineer dominating the profile, one needs to nail the application and convince adcoms of one's merits. Adcoms look at personal, academic and professional factors in their assessment. You have a great gpa from an Ivy, unique story and career progression. Your production company follows business principles and you have made it work by understanding the entertainment industry. You need to explain why MBA for you and how does the MBA help you in reaching your professional goals. Also communicate what you can bring sth to the table and enrich the class. Add EC activities to the mix. I remember that some Hollywood writer and talent agency executive enrolled at Rice and Booth, both career changers. I am surprised that Wharton expects you to take pre MBA quant classes given you took classes as Penn undergrad. Nail the Gmat. By the way, Executive MBAs have a higher selectivity rate vs full time MBA and hence easier to get into Executive programmes. Your industry and metropolitan interest would pre select certain programmes. Most courses are covered by statistics, calculus and algebra. Unless you like hardcore computational finance or advanced portfolio theory. Good luck. From: anak84 To: Jock4Mba Thank you so much. Really useful info, I appreciate it. One thing however, you wrote " By the way, Executive MBAs have a higher selectivity rate vs full time MBA and hence easier to get into Executive programmes." If Executive MBAs have a higher selectivity rate wouldn't they be harder to get into than full time MBA programs? From: Jock4Mba To: anak84 Example: school A receives 1,000 applications and made offers to 200 applicants. The selectivity rate would be 20%. School B: 1,000 applications and made offers to 350 applicants. The selectivity rate would be 35%. School B has higher selectivity rate (admission rate). From: anak84 To: Jock4Mba Gotcha. I just misinterpreted what your were saying. I took it to mean the opposite but I see what you meant now. From: Jock4Mba To: anak84 My advice for non traditional applicant working in environment without many MBAs is to reach out to student clubs of target schools. For you it would be Media/Entertainment Clubs (Kellogg, Wharton, Stern, Anderson, CBS? have one). Student members have similar interests and career goals. They may also give you some useful pointers, name recruiters and support you in your quest. Also useful to refer club activities to adcoms why this specific school and how you would get involved once admitted. It shows that you look closer at programme and not only at ranking spot. From: anak84 To: Jock4Mba Thank you again. You offer wonderful suggestions that I will follow up on. From: BlakeThomas To: anak84 I am applying as well, though with 3 years experience. However, my cousin is 31 and applying this year. He went to HYP, had a 3.9 in chemistry but decided to become a professional classical musician. He's one of the smartest guys I know, scored a 780 on his GMATs and wants to become a management consultant so that he can help run our family's business back in Europe. Basically people are telling him he has no shot at HBS or Stanford, as they only take really young applicants, however, there is more of a chance at Wharton and Kellogg, if that helps. I think Sandy is right, for all the talk of b school's desire for diversity, older oddball candidates typically don't get in. I think the fact that you had a 3.9 from Penn helps a lot, and hopefully a GMAT score as well, but HBS and Stanford are probably not happening. From: Entropy To: BlakeThomas When I visited wharton last week, i met a guy who was 31, graduated from HYP in 2001, and work in the energy industry. I don't know the exact details of his work, but he was visiting schools as well, and he said he just interviewed with harvard business. He mentioned how shocked he was that he got an invite given that they're very biased against older applicants. The OP has a very unique profile. I think he actually might have a better chance at stanford than at HBS since they're more open to "oddball" candidates. But for HBS, Sandy is right that older accepted applicants usually are from the military or have advanced degrees like MD, Phd, JD. From: anak84 To: Entropy Interesting. Harvard is at the bottom of my list so that's no problem here. I'd much prefer Columbia or Stern. My main interest is in film not banking and I plan to maintain work in the film industry during my MBA and Boston is a bit of a dead city as far as entertainment. I'm a huge Yankees fan as well and would prefer to focus on my marketing classes than weekly barfights. LoL. Stanford on the other hand is a top 5 choice for me so this does break my heart a little. I'm looking internationally as well at schools like Insead, IE, and Oxford. I have family all over Europe and come from a very diverse ethnic background and lived in 19 cities around the world growing up so I may stand in good favor with one of the international programs. This still doesn't help my desire to produce films but it may help me get my hooks into foreign distribution and marketing. The downward spiral of the US economy is a growing concern so living across the pond is an option I am not averse to. I also won't be applying until next year. By the time I take the GMAT and get through all my applications I'd of missed the first two deadlines. What I'm a little puzzled over is that though it makes sense for an age prejudice within the realm of an MBA I think it belies the point of an Executive MBA. I doubt Harvard expects 25 year olds to apply for an executive MBA! Well unless your name ends in Zuckerberg. This newsletter is a FREE service provided by BusinessWeek.com. To sign up for other newsletters, cancel delivery, change delivery options or change your e-mail address, please go to our Newsletter Preferences page. If you need other assistance, please contact Customer Service or contact: Wanda Cooper BusinessWeek Customer Rights Communications Data Services 1995 G Avenue Red Oak, IA 51566 Phone: 1-800-635-1200 To learn more about how BusinessWeek.com applies this policy, you can contact our Marketing Department. Copyright 2009-2010 by BLOOMBERG L.P. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Terms of Use | Privacy Notice

B-School Insider Dear Reader: No, that's not a typo. MBA job placement rates at top schools, after two years in terra incognita, are indeed on the upswing, the result of a surge in hiring late in the school year. But as Alison Damast reports, that's not the whole picture. Salaries are flat, signing bonuses are disappearing, and even this year's modest improvement in placement rates didn't get many schools even remotely close to what they were during the go-go years before the financial crisis. Is this a case of simply not being out of the woods yet, or are the woods deeper and darker than anyone expected? Have we witnessed a permanent rupture in the market value of the MBA? Time will tell. Finally, a reminder: Our latest ranking of U.S. and international full-time MBA programs—our first in two years—will be published today, Nov. 11. Please join us as we count down the winners online and take questions during a live chat event. The countdown is scheduled for noon ET on Nov. 11. To take part just head to the Chat Auditorium about 10 minutes before the event. Details on the chat will be posted on the Business Schools channel of Businessweek.com (look under More Business Schools News). Can't make it? No problem. Just email your questions in advance (subject line: 2010 Rankings Chat) to the host, Francesca Di Meglio at FDBloombergBW@gmail.com. Hope to see you there! Louis Lavelle Business Schools Editor Bloomberg Businessweek E-MAIL A FRIEND  |  GET RSS  |  NEWSLETTERS B-SCHOOLS NEW ON MBA INSIDER >> UCLA Anderson: Admissions Q&A MBA Admissions Director Mae Jennifer Shores explains what UCLA's Anderson school has to offer and what it takes to get in MBA Insider Subscribers Only Advertisement B-SCHOOLS MULTIMEDIA MBA >> Cambridge Judge Business School Making the transition to collaborative innovation Dr Chander Velu What’s Your Problem? Trouble at the office? In surveys, blogs, polls, and social media, BusinessWeek collaborated with readers to identify problems at work. Together we found answers.  IN YOUR FACE: THE FASTER, CHEAPER MBA Reader Dorothy Beach Writes: " People are losing patience with an MBA system that is too linear, not relevant so get it done as quickly as possible to get on with what is real. " Tell Us: Leery of Year-Long MBA Programs?     Tools & Features MBA Insider Check out this feature-rich area for advice and tools that will help you choose the right B-school -- and develop a strategy for getting accepted Full-Time MBA Rankings & Profiles BusinessWeek's Top 30 U.S. programs and Top 10 international programs. Plus, scan in-depth profiles of more than 300 full-time programs around the world The Best Undergraduate B-Schools Undergrad business programs are getting MBA-like respect, and competition to get into them is hotter than ever. Here's how the top schools stack up B-School Calendar BusinessWeek.com's scheduling tool will give you an idea of upcoming events at B-schools in the U.S. and around the world. You'll find information on admissions receptions, application deadlines, networking events, alumni events, conferences, and much more. EMBA Rankings & Profiles BusinessWeek's biennial Executive MBA rankings grade 25 programs worldwide. Plus, you'll find profiles of nearly 200 programs Exec Ed Rankings & Profiles Here are BusinessWeek's top 20 Executive Education programs. Plus, profiles of more than 100 programs worldwide Advertisement   FEATURED SPECIAL REPORT >> Perfecting Your Business School Application Slide Shows Slide Show: Best U.S. Business Schools Video Video: How to Choose Recommendation Writers GMAT Test Prep: A User's Guide Not all GMAT test-preparation services are created equal. Use this guide to find out which one is right for you How to Write an MBA Admissions Essay Be clear about your career goals and how business school can help you achieve them. But most of all be yourself Make Your Leadership Case for Business School Extracurriculars: The Extras That Count The College Visit 101 Chat: MBA Admissions Tips READER COMMENTS > MORE SPECIAL REPORTS >  BW MALL  SPONSORED LINKS Buy a link now!